Found this notification this morning on my pixel 6.
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Wait a second. You’re expecting Google to not FUD? Ha ha ha oh wow. I mean I didn’t actually expect them to do so, but yeah.
Wth is fud?
Fear, Uncertainty, Doubt. It’s more commonly used in crypto communities.
Expected, no. Surprised, also no.
Google: “Forcing us to divest Chrome could have impacts on our ability to support Mozilla and their high executive salaries as we own the space with Chrome.”
Also Google:
Google warning you about Mozilla is just peak fucking irony
Alright gang, what are some good open source Firefox forks available on Android and Linux?
Librewolf for Linux. And ironfox on android
Waterfox
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i mean it’s just because you can grant websites location data and toggle telemetry.
“Quick! Jump to chrome instead!” - Google spokesperson
Deactivate from settings Have https always on, protection against tracking on strict, data collection and daily ping on off.
And that’s it.
Fennec is great on Android
I’ve been pretty happy with it as my casual web search browser, putting all my social media on a different browser. And it’s in F-Droid, so that always feels good.
Firefox engines have telemetry since old ages. Do you know what even crazier ??? even other firefox browser like fennec has Mozilla telemetry.
PSA : disable it with Blocker (ROOT) for more privacySending telemetry like crashes and what features you use/don’t use isn’t really in the same category as using location data for marketing purposes. It’s a very important distinction to draw.
It has a mozilla telemetry component, but that doesn’t mean that it’s necessarily reporting to mozilla - which wouldn’t make much sense anyway - nor that it actually functions at all. Most telemetry components in Firefox can’t simply be deleted because it causes stuff to break, so they are replaced with stubs that don’t actually do anything.
Assuming that’s all it’s really doing.
That’s a regular notification, which would happen for any application whose data policy is changed on the Play Store page. These policy are as declared by the app publisher. This would be the same for any application that didn’t check that “sharing data with third party” box earlier, then checked it later on.
I don’t get what your comment is getting at. I don’t view this post as saying anything special or unique about the notification. I see it as a warning that Firefox is now doing this.
Have you read all the other replies? “Google mad”, “Google putting Firefox in the dirt”, “False info”, etc.
I interpret top level comments as responses to OP unless they say something otherwise.
Friendship ended with Firefox. Waterfox is my new best friend ❤️
IceCat.
Unfortunately I am primarily an android user, as I always have my phone with me.
I shall give it a go for desktop at some point though
Ironfox seems to work well on Android.
So does Waterfox. :)
Pot Calling Kettle… etc… 🤣
I know, right, the fucking balls of Google to fucking say this
Because they are legally obligated to mention it?
Are they? What law?
Probably GDPR if I had to guess. Seems like anything decent these companies do can be directly traced back to GDPR.
Edit: guys, “probably” means that I’m unsure.
No GDPR does not require google to display app permissions like that…
Your just making things up.
Do you want the short or the long version?
A link to it will do
Show me where I made something up, boss. Or do you not know what “probably” means?
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Do you? Because made up satistics are still made up.
This is how misinformation starts.
If your not sure, google it before commenting. For the sanity of the internet.
…except they don’t for their own browser.
It’s literally there.
This is not at all a pot kettle situation, there is no reason to warn about Firefox.
As of the latest Chrome update on PC, they have dropped support for uBlock. You can still technically enable it, but they disabled it by default once you update.
That got me back to Firefox with breakneck speed.
Hopefully soon Librewolf, Fennec F-droid and other forks will become mainstream.
I haven’t switched to Librewolf on pc yet; hoping that turning off the telemetry/etc options in ff is enough, but I’m starting to think it might not be long.
I switched over to LibreWolf recently. I discovered Vivaldi just a few hours before I learned about the Manifest v3 stuff for Chromium (which is a shame because I actually LOVED Vivaldi). I really want to try Zen Browser, but I’m using old, 2011-era Macs (running Ubuntu 24.04 on one) and it won’t install. LibreWolf is great because of its clean, minimal design and absolute privacy-forward thinking. I’ve enjoyed it so far (and I’m only running it on the Ubuntu machine).
I want to switch over further but so far I’ve had so much else going on that data privacy hasn’t taken a priority. Things are getting weird now so it is time for a priority change.
Frankly speaking, calling out Google and Chrome, then moving to Firefox while Mozilla have been doing it’s best Google impression for years now is not that great of a plan.
I wonder how long Firefox will be ok with all that, since Mozilla bought that advertisement business a while ago.
The main problem is that building a web browser is extremely difficult and everyone else uses Google’s version of WebKit. So there’s no alternatives: it’s either Google or Mozilla. Forks don’t count because if some functionality that end users need is deprecated, nobody will maintain it and it will just disappear once it’s removed from the main codebase
Hopefully Servo will change that
Yes, I agree. That’s why I’m weirded out by people saying “Firefox bad, use Librewolf” and the like.
I still think a solution that relies on donation (maybe with some corporate support) would be very good for everyone involved. Unfortunately, Mozilla is not a player in this, so we’re stuck with basically three engines, one that can’t be used, one that’s openly hostile, and one that’s becoming hostile.
Not great.
building a web browser is extremely difficult and everyone else uses Google’s version of WebKit
To be fair it is based on KHTML. One of projects KDE can spend that extra money on and resurrect.
Bring back Konqueror too while at it!
Edit: Apparently it still exists, it just isn’t the default on any mainstream distros anymore
Saying KHTML = WebKit is like saying a sponge is a killer whale.
So if Mozilla wants to monetize location data, what does this mean for all the custom ROMs that use Mozilla’s location provider instead of Google’s?
This might mean that we would have no true free location provider left.
Edit: just was thinking, what does this mean for Firefox forks that also use Mozilla’s location service?
So if Mozilla wants to monetize location data, what does this mean for all the custom ROMs that use Mozilla’s location provider instead of Google’s?
Nothing, because they dont sell location data, this just seems like a routine warning that pops up when ToS and Privacy policy changes, and since they have clarified their position on this matter, (not to mention the lack of alternative FOSS web engines). We really shouldn’t let this bother us
Of course i might be wrong and it may come out that Mozilla has turned heel(lot of heel turning happening lately)
wait, mozilla has a location provider? maybe there is open street map, idk what’s the difference between a map and a location provider
My (probably incomplete) understanding is: phones have a GNSS chip (such as GPS, Galileo, or Glonass), but getting location from that takes a long time and a lot of battery. So they estimate location based on other information such as what cell tower they are connected to and the list of available wi-fi networks. This requires a database with all that info, which Google built through its Street View cars.
So the location provider is a service to which your phone sends all the info it has and which replies with an estimate of your location; which means it handles a lot of sensitive data.
ooh does openstreetmap have a location viewer? it would be better for privacy than mozzila and google
Fork it, split it off, share it.
Even if this isn’t entirely true, you know Google wouldn’t pass up the opportunity to reduce Firefox market share to scare everyone back to Chrome.
Firefox? You mean the company they give several hundred million dollars/year? Yeah I don’t think they’re too worried. They need some number of users on Firefox to prevent anti-trust issues. Which they’re on the brink of right now.
There’s no need to reduce Firefox marketshare. Most people don’t even consider using anything else than whatever is default in their device.
Also, it’s not a Google scare tactic or a flex. Every application on the Play Store must disclose the general outlines of their data policy, including the sharing of data. Lying with those checkbox is not a good idea but they are completely informative and put there by the publishing party, so the people responsible for publishing Firefox on mobile just updated these, and this is what is shown when an app publisher say their app is sharing data with third parties.
tl;dr: it’s very likely that not a single soul at Google even looked at this, as this is just the regular behavior of the Play Store with apps that changes their data policy or indicate sharing user data with third parties.
Why the dichotomy between the chrome listing on the store then?
No idea, I’m not that obsessed with it. But do note that “The developers of these apps provided info about their data sharing practices to an app store. They may update it over time.” and “Data sharing practices may vary based on your app version, use, region, and age.”
The recent changes to Firefox terms of use (well, their introduction really) was supposedly meant to appease some regional lawmakers. Maybe it is a regional thing. Maybe they changed it again. Maybe it’s, as often with store page update, rolled out progressively to people (in either direction, whether it’s adding or removing these terms).
The point is, that’s neither a “Google” operation to put Firefox in a bad light, nor a Mozilla operation to… do whatever it is they’re doing these days. It’s just a regular message. Which, reading a lot of the replies here, is something that have to be said.
There isn’t to much to reduce. I don’t think Google is scared or afraid by Firefox, like at all.
Like chrome does something different?
It integrates into the Google ecosystem well, and if that has value to a person it may just be enough to bring them back to chrome.
Who would use the Google ecosystem? Yuck. 🤮
Yes, chrome is doing something different. It is even worse!
That’s not the point they’re trying to make I think. It’s more of an attack on perfection. Like “the alternative is not perfect either so why not just stay with Chrome”. It’s not a very strong argument in general but it might be enough to keep people from switching.
the alternative is not perfect either so why not just stay
It does work for a lot of people. Seeing they need to change and adapt if they do change, and it seemingly seems to be as bad as what they’re using now, why change and face headaches and hassle.
exactly, when confronted with cognitive dissonance people look for any shitty excuse to avoid changing their minds.
No but where are you going to go. The options are shrinking.
Fennec on mobile. LibreWolf on desktop.
Waterfox works great on Android.
Iron fox is another option.
Zen browser is great on desktop
Zen, at least from the few times that I’ve tried it, also has some major issues that I personally find to be deal-breakers. Like forgetting tabs in a window that has just been closed. If you accidentally close a window that you’re working, without quitting the browser, you lose everything in it. As someone who is prone to doing that when closing a tab, it’s not ideal.
Lol if Google really wanted to kill FF they would just stop paying them half a billion a year.
I wonder if they say people should be careful with Chrome 😂
they don’t have to! they microsoft explorered that shit
So you’re advocating that Google shouldn’t broadcast that firefox is broadcasting your current location? Even though they do this for every other app available on Android, you’re saying they shouldn’t do this for firefox?
Why?
This notice is effectively added by the Firefox developers when they select the ability to enable location services and also tick a box thay they collect data.
They want to scare people to stay on Chrome now that they discontinued support of uBlock (not that it was ever supported on Chrome for Android anyway)
So they do this for all apps. Every single app that is in the Android ecosystem. But in your mind they’re specifically targeting firefox with this to make people “scared” huh?
Must be nice to live in denial.
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terrible choice of link. There was a stack of reporting from various tech-news sites and blogs; but you’ve given as the nazi site.
The story I heard was that by of California’s definition of selling data, doing anything with user data that could benefit the company was considered selling data. So they updated their FAQ to be in line with that definition. But I could be wrong, if someone could point me to a good article I’d appreciate it.
Here’s Louis Rossmann’s wiki where he details it. I hope that helps.
Thanks! Sounds like limiting risk from the California bill is a plausible reason, but it isn’t confirmed.
Legal Definitions of “Selling Data” Under the CCPA Are Broad: As noted above, the CCPA’s definition encompasses many data-sharing practices that may not align with common understanding of “selling data”.[16] Even if Mozilla was not directly selling user data, its search partnerships, telemetry data sharing, & sponsored content could have been interpreted as data sales if Mozilla received any financial benefit from them, all of which were actions that Mozilla has already been transparent & upfront about.
Mozilla’s Search Engine Deals Could Be Considered Data Sales: As mentioned earlier, these partnerships could legally qualify as data sales under the CCPA definition, despite being an existing part of Mozilla’s business model that consumers are already aware of.[1]
Sponsored Content in Firefox’s New Tab Page Involves Data Exchange: Mozilla dReferencesisplays sponsored content and ads on the Firefox New Tab page, which may involve user interaction data being shared with advertisers.[11] Even if the data is anonymized, the CCPA considers certain types of aggregated data as personal information if it can be linked back to users.[16]
It sounds like a bullshit excuse, to me.
If they wanted to cover their ass, they could have changed their ToS any number of different ways than what they went with.
Let’s not be naïve. All corporations are the enemy, including Mozilla.
To be fair they are a company with bills to pay and they have to shield themselves from being fined or sued. At this point I assume almost everything has been backdoored to hell and I’d rather use the product from the company with better overall terms and principles.
i’m a person with bills to pay, but if i paid those bills by endangering people, i’d be a bad person.
corporations exist to protect people from the financial and legal repercussions of their business activity.
they should not exist, and so, I will celebrate if Mozilla goes into bankruptcy.
we do not need them. control of firefox should be in the hands of a not-for-profit group, not a company.
ACAB? C being Companies.
A weird number of C things fit in there.
Cops Companies CEOs
In short: yes.
You’re saying “exploiting” user data might have been more precise than “selling”. Either way I don’t want them doing it.
