Jaypg

Yes, it’s trivial because it doesn’t impact workflow or productivity. I don’t run out of RAM but if I did it would just page old data out to disk. It could be improved but it’s not something that needs fixing so I don’t care (and FYI if you have less physical memory Windows will just use less. I remember testing Windows 10 with 2G of RAM on a Core2Duo years ago because I was curious.) Wasting literally any amount of my productivity time because something doesn’t follow industry standards is irritating. And for clarity I’m not simply talking about the panel/bar.

Computers are tools. When I use a computer it’s because I want to do something specific, not do something and also deal with the operating system at the same time. I want it to work as a tool should. Intuitively. Like, I love Bazzite which is technically a desktop Linux distribution if you’re loose with the definition of desktop. When I sit down on the couch and want to play a video game for an hour, Bazzite just works. Windows would work just as well there but I won’t fault Bazzite for that. The tool does the job and does it intuitively. Different is fine as long as it’s intuitive and/or improves the user experience. When I look at Gnome for example I just can’t see it improving anything. It’s doing its own thing and its own thing isn’t very good.

Frankly, yes. You’re half-right. To list out every problem I have with every Linux desktop I’ve used over the last 20 years I would have to sit down and use them all again and re-frustrate myself all over again. I don’t spend my free time reminiscing of bad software design. When I have shitty experiences with something I don’t continue with it. I remember some problems with Ubuntu in the Unity days was the left panel and something to do with the screen being mostly taken up by something that I can’t remember when you clicked the launcher, but I remember it was translucent. I also remember hardware support sucked on the older kernels Ubuntu used but I think I’m dating myself there. As some other commenter pointed out, the Samba credential caching is a PITA. Gnome 3 needs additional tweaks or terminal commands to change anything to be more like what you’d expect to find on 9 out of 10 computers around the world. Some distros or DE’s put the window controls on the wrong side like macOS (yes, I hate that macOS puts window controls on the unintuitive side). This may have changed at some point, I don’t know, but historically installing some applications will invariably use some other UI kit and look completely out of place. I feel like I shouldn’t have brought that up and opened that can of worms either, but Linux desktops are generally ugly. KDE is fine. Gnome is so-so. Budgie has potential. If you count Steam’s TV mode, it’s both intuitive and aesthetically pleasing. Everything else I’ve used is just ugly regardless of its ease of use.

Anyway, I’m finished. Think what you want about Linux desktops. I’ll think what I want. Both of us have better things to do than this.

To me, every Windows gripe you just listed is trivial to work around. What I’m saying, perhaps poorly, is why should I have to work around them. Why aren’t the defaults sane and just work? KDE has the most sane defaults to me for a Linux DE that follow written and unwritten industry standards, but generally speaking it’s the exception and not the rule and I’d still prefer using something else. Using Linux as a desktop is irritating. Just a lot of “why is it like that? That’s dumb.” It’s not that it’s just sooooo impossible to use a desktop with a launcher in another position. It’s that I think it’s a stupid decision and have to spend time researching if and how that mistake can be fixed when I shouldn’t have to. It’s ok to stand on the shoulders of giants and do what everybody has been doing and expecting for the last 40+ years.

Why does macOS stick the toolbar along the top? Apple thinks it’s better UX design to have a unified area for that UI element regardless of window position. Makes sense. Passes the sniff test. Gnome sticking the bar on the left edge enhances the user experience and makes the environment easier to use? No, doesn’t pass the sniff test. But I agree, macOS does toolbars different. I would prefer if Windows adopted that design too. But if something deviates from a standard and you have no reasoning to how it improves anything or enhances the UX, hipster design. Different for the sake of being different.

You asked for an example. I’m not going to spend a lot of time thinking of the best example when any example will do. For some, sure it’s more difficult. Like that fake triangle tablet. Is that something you could get used to or learn to live with? Yeah, but why should you spend time learning how to “fix” it when everybody else does it a different and standard way? For a desktop it’s also one of the most important UI elements on screen FYI. The first introduction to a new user shouldn’t be to confuse them for no reason.

But I’ll circle back to it’s just being different for the sake of being different, not because it’s better or easier. Unless you have some point on how it’s somehow better and more intuitive, again, it’s just hipster app development.

Re: KDE, I do use it on the Linux desktop I rarely touch. It’s also used on my Bazzite box for if I ever need desktop mode. The KDE defaults aren’t perfect but they’re the most sane of all the environments I’ve tried, and believe me over the last 22 years I think I’ve probably tried them all at some point. Calling any example I bring up trivial would be fine, but aren’t your gripes with Windows also trivial and something you couldn’t just work around?

Oh, ok. Fair enough. How about the Unity and/or Gnome3 dock as an example? Windows historically: taskbar at the bottom, app menu first icon. MacOS historically: dock at the bottom, app launcher second icon. Unity: Putting our dock where everyone else is? Nonsense. It’s on the left now which isn’t any easier to use. 🤡 Gnome3: App launcher as the first icon? Who’s going to want to ever find and launch an app? Stick that useless icon at the very end. 🤡

It’s just being different for the sake of being different, not because it makes more sense or is any more intuitive. Frankly it’s just hipster app development.

While generally better than Linux as a desktop, Windows does shit the bed a lot. MacOS is the best desktop OS IMO. Sane defaults, nothing visual I really feel like changing, built in apps are all solid and they, and the entire system, all play nicely with one another. It also somewhat does immutability.

It feels like Linux UI and UX developers (generally speaking) are more interested in doing things different for the sake of different rather than using common sense. Personally, I just find it annoying. It’s like that one episode of The Office where they made that triangle-shaped tablet. Linux desktops are that triangle tablet and will unironically preach about how it’s actually the most efficient way to use a tablet, completely ignoring that 97% of computer users have always used a square and will be using a square for decades to come.

For every year Capcom doesn’t make MegaMan Legends 3, an executive needs to be launched out of a trebuchet right into a wall.

Spitting facts. I generally use Linux for any server need, but I’m convinced that people using Linux as a desktop have absolutely nothing to do all day and can spend all their time researching, tweaking, and installing a mishmash of software to make it usable for them.

The best desktop experience I’ve had with Linux is Fedora Kinoite and ironically it cuts against the grain by locking down the base system and making it immutable. Same thing with Bazzite on my TV PC. I can just sit down and achieve my task I needed a computer for without having to waste time screwing around with anything extra.